Career Pathways with Adrienne Hannan – Children’s and Youth Services Coordinator
In this column we interview LIS professionals – finding out how they got to where they are and any advice they have for students or new professionals. Our second interview subject is Adrienne Hannan, Children’s and Youth Services Coordinator, Wellington City Libraries
Kia ora Adrienne and thanks for sharing your career pathway with our readers. First up, can you tell us about your current role? What is your job title and what do you do day-to-day? Can you also tell us what qualifications you have?
I’m the Children’s and Youth Services Coordinator at Wellington City Libraries. I cover all the operational (and often strategic) aspects of our programmes, events, and services for 0 – 18 year olds and their families. My role covers service design, training and professional development, marketing and communication, resourcing, and relationship management.
Is this the career you always intended to go into?
No. Libraries started out as an after-school and weekend job when I was in high school as a way to earn a bit of pocket money. I started out as a Circulation Assistant with the former Waitakere City Libraries.
I actually had my eye on a career in aviation with the military but, despite passing all the entrance tests, the Air Force thought I was too young to be a pilot at 17 (fair call!). So I took up full time work as a Library Assistant to fill the gap while I came up with Plan B. My library work funded lots of overseas travel, renting and buying homes, and a fun lifestyle for a young adult in a big city. When the Air Force came knocking later on (apparently I had matured sufficiently),
I actually realised that I was enjoying this library gig and could see the potential in the career, and decided to stay civilian (for a while, anyway; I later joined the Army Reserve). At this point I moved into the specialist CYA role and started picking up papers at Open Polytechnic. A career that wasn’t even my Plan B, became my Plan A.
What was your idea of what librarians are and what they do before you became one?
I had been raised to value books and reading, and my family visited libraries regularly. Our house always had stuffed bookcases, and we all enjoyed reading as a preferred past time.
My impression of librarians was that they simply issued/returned books, and walked you (at a tremendous speed for a small child) to the shelves to find a title. Some were kind, but most didn’t really seem to pay much attention to children, unless we were misbehaving.
I don’t have any memories of going to events or programmes at our local libraries, but that never really bothered me. The adventures and wondrous facts that the books contained were fulfilling enough for me.
Because I started my first library job at age 14, I’ve had the privilege of seeing what happens behind the scenes since then, so my teen and adult experiences of librarians and libraries are not of a customer perspective.
When I started working as a CYA librarian, I made sure that I created special interactions with children and teens, and went out of my way to help and chat with them. I remembered that feeling of not being considered an ‘important’ library user as a child, and I wanted to change that impression.
Can you tell us a little bit more about your first library job at 14? How did you come to it, what did you do, where was it?
At the time my mother was working for the local city council and she saw a role come up at our local library in Massey. I put together an application and was granted an interview. For the interview I had to show that I could use a DOS system on a computer, navigate the computer and card catalogue, and put books into alpha-numerical order. The Circulation Assistant helped with issues and returns, reserves and simple directional enquiries. We were expected to refer the customer to a Library Assistant for anything enquiry that was more complex than ‘where on the shelf is this title/subject?’ or ‘do you have the latest book by…?’ It was a good introduction for me, but before long I was being scolded by the branch librarian for overstepping my role and answering more in-depth enquiries.
If you were meeting someone who had just finished their undergraduate degree and was contemplating doing a postgraduate LIS qualification what would you say to them? What sort of personal attributes do you think you need to go into LIS work? Particularly working with Children and Young Adults.
A lot of people I encounter have a fixed mind-set about librarians/libraries are, or should be. In a modern world that changes so quickly, people seem to cling to libraries as lifeboats that preserve a more ‘traditional’ way of life. People tend to think of libraries in comforting nostalgic terms, and this can be problematic when libraries are faced with the challenges of evolving, embracing technology, and providing service in a modern and convenient way.
Librarians themselves are not immune to this mind-set, and are often found to be resisting or avoiding change. It’s tricky for a library to be everything to everybody, and to balance out the traditional service aspects, which still have their place, with the more modern ones.
It’s important for librarians to have a flexible mind-set, to be enthusiastic about adapting and learning new skills continuously, to appreciate technology and understand its application and use in the information age. We are lucky to work in a field where we can self-define our identity and purpose, and change our services to meet the continuously evolving needs of our communities – which requires librarians to agile thinkers and entrepreneurs.
Working in CYA services, in particular, requires energy, considerable initiative in designing new and original children's programmes; ability to work well with young people, both individually and in groups; ability to deal effectively with parents, teachers and community organisations; confidence in presenting and being in front of groups; and the skills to advocate strongly for libraries and CYA interests to third parties. Like most customer and public-facing roles, a sense of humour is a must.
I really enjoyed doing my qualification. It has given me an appreciation of the skills and knowledge required across the whole spectrum of library roles, and I often refer back to my studies to guide my decisions in regards to best practice and industry consistency. The papers are very useful in helping me to design modern services and strategy that meets the developmental and social needs of young people. Regardless of whether you pursue a career in libraries, I feel that the qualifications are important and useful in this modern information age, and are widely transferable into other fields of work.
If someone was thinking about changing careers to become a CYA librarian what sorts of jobs do you think would bring good transferable skills? I guess teaching is an obvious one, can you think of any others? Acting? Events management?
Yes, teaching is an obvious one; teachers bring so many transferable skills. Often we have employed people from the arts, performance, or creative industries – they have an innovative flair and a different viewpoint of the world. For public libraries especially, a customer service background is always desirable; the ability to positively interact with the wide array of library users is essential. People with social work backgrounds are bringing a skill set that is increasingly in demand in public libraries; for CYA librarians experience as a Youth Worker or working in the child/youth social support sector would appeal to us. We also sometimes see people make the sideways move across from museums and galleries; those who have worked in public programming in the GLAM sector will be very useful in CYA librarianship, as well as for other customer group specialities.
Have you got any librarian mentors / people who influenced you or you admire / learned from? What did they teach you?
The first person I really noticed as being influential on me was Su Scott, who was the manager at Waitakere Libraries. She showed me that libraries could be a progressive and innovative place, and always surprised me with ideas that were considered radical at the time, but clearly she was just ahead of her time. She gave me opportunities that allowed me to stretch into new comfort zones and explore my potential. She showed me that a library career could be an exciting and rewarding option. Much of the reason I am working in libraries I credit to her.
The people that have influenced me the most are those who allow others to take on responsibility and participate, and help them to navigate the workload as coaches. Early on I learned that literacy is not about books, but about people, language and connections, and to focus on the mortar as much as the bricks. Others have taught me to look at obstacles as things to overcome and not as excuses, and how to adjust my leadership and communication styles to those I am leading, rather than to suit myself and my preferences. More recently a library manager that I look up to told me to value myself and my time more by saying ‘no’ every so often, and I might be surprised that I become more productive, not less.
You have a very exciting sounding life outside of libraries. Can you tell us about all your extracurricular activities? How do you balance work and play? Have you learned anything from your recreational pursuits that inform your library work?
I work full-time for Wellington City Libraries, and part-time as a Combat Medic in the New Zealand Army Reserve. I also do triathlons (long-distance and Ironman), and the odd ultramarathon. I have a lovely preschooler who is my number one fan when it comes to reading stories aloud. Shout out to my super supportive husband!
I enjoy a busy and full life, but it’s tricky to balance it all out. I have a few tricks up my sleeve. I don’t have a customer-facing component or a roster in my job, so I’m able to be quite fluid in when and where I work. I often snatch work time in the mornings, evenings, and weekends to create a more flexible day or week for myself, and if I’m between meetings I’ll often ‘hotdesk’ with my laptop in a cafe with WiFi rather than return to the office. I use time when I’m running, biking, or swimming to have a meeting with myself to make lists, priorities, decisions, and plans, which means I’m ready to get cracking when I log in. I’ve figured out that I work best with a deadline, so I plot out all my work and projects against dates, and hold myself accountable to them.
I’m used to being very independent, so I’m still learning how to delegate and ask for help when I need it. It’s a current focus for me to get better at this. I’ve realised in attempting to do all the work myself that I’m not allowing others to grow and learn.
The New Zealand Army has a unique way of training and growing people that has had a positive impact on my overall approach to work and life. Not least it has given me new benchmarks in hard work, and what I can personally endure and achieve. My army training has given me the courage to make decisions, develop personal discipline that takes over when motivation has a bit of a break, and to act fast on the information available to me. A sense of personal integrity means I’m not afraid to admit when I’ve stuffed up.
In trying to fit sport training around all other aspects of my job, my number one rule is ‘gears before beers’. I finish a training session, tidy up, repack for the next round, do the laundry (the gears) before relaxing to reflect, recharge, and learn the lessons (the beers). Too often we lurch from one project or priority to the next without closing off the former and taking the time to reflect and learn.
Most importantly I try to always keep my sense of humour and see the funny side of a situation. Personal resilience is so important, especially when things are not going to plan, so I’m always ready to have a laugh at myself and the situation.
You sound extremely efficient with your time management! I love the idea of how you “use time when I’m running, biking, or swimming to have a meeting with myself to make lists, priorities, decisions, and plans” Do you have any other life hacks you can share with our readers?
Most of my hacks are in the way I think and approach things rather than physical (except you should always carry a notebook or some way to record your ideas and inspiration). Our actions and behaviours are usually a representation of how we think and process internally, so you can make adjustments to your outputs by changing what’s happening internally. Here’s some that come to mind:
These are gold! Thanks so much Adrienne for sharing your knowledge and experiences with us.
I’m the Children’s and Youth Services Coordinator at Wellington City Libraries. I cover all the operational (and often strategic) aspects of our programmes, events, and services for 0 – 18 year olds and their families. My role covers service design, training and professional development, marketing and communication, resourcing, and relationship management.
- At Wellington City Libraries we use talented generalist library staff to deliver our children and youth services, rather than specialists. So essentially my role is to ensure they have everything they need to be able to do this (training, resourcing, support), and to ensure the success of the service (promotion, service design, analysis and reporting). I create processes for library staff to design and deliver their own programmes and events. I also play a part in managing and writing website and social media content.
- I have a BAppSci in Library and Information Studies from the Open Polytechnic.
Is this the career you always intended to go into?
No. Libraries started out as an after-school and weekend job when I was in high school as a way to earn a bit of pocket money. I started out as a Circulation Assistant with the former Waitakere City Libraries.
I actually had my eye on a career in aviation with the military but, despite passing all the entrance tests, the Air Force thought I was too young to be a pilot at 17 (fair call!). So I took up full time work as a Library Assistant to fill the gap while I came up with Plan B. My library work funded lots of overseas travel, renting and buying homes, and a fun lifestyle for a young adult in a big city. When the Air Force came knocking later on (apparently I had matured sufficiently),
I actually realised that I was enjoying this library gig and could see the potential in the career, and decided to stay civilian (for a while, anyway; I later joined the Army Reserve). At this point I moved into the specialist CYA role and started picking up papers at Open Polytechnic. A career that wasn’t even my Plan B, became my Plan A.
What was your idea of what librarians are and what they do before you became one?
I had been raised to value books and reading, and my family visited libraries regularly. Our house always had stuffed bookcases, and we all enjoyed reading as a preferred past time.
My impression of librarians was that they simply issued/returned books, and walked you (at a tremendous speed for a small child) to the shelves to find a title. Some were kind, but most didn’t really seem to pay much attention to children, unless we were misbehaving.
I don’t have any memories of going to events or programmes at our local libraries, but that never really bothered me. The adventures and wondrous facts that the books contained were fulfilling enough for me.
Because I started my first library job at age 14, I’ve had the privilege of seeing what happens behind the scenes since then, so my teen and adult experiences of librarians and libraries are not of a customer perspective.
When I started working as a CYA librarian, I made sure that I created special interactions with children and teens, and went out of my way to help and chat with them. I remembered that feeling of not being considered an ‘important’ library user as a child, and I wanted to change that impression.
Can you tell us a little bit more about your first library job at 14? How did you come to it, what did you do, where was it?
At the time my mother was working for the local city council and she saw a role come up at our local library in Massey. I put together an application and was granted an interview. For the interview I had to show that I could use a DOS system on a computer, navigate the computer and card catalogue, and put books into alpha-numerical order. The Circulation Assistant helped with issues and returns, reserves and simple directional enquiries. We were expected to refer the customer to a Library Assistant for anything enquiry that was more complex than ‘where on the shelf is this title/subject?’ or ‘do you have the latest book by…?’ It was a good introduction for me, but before long I was being scolded by the branch librarian for overstepping my role and answering more in-depth enquiries.
If you were meeting someone who had just finished their undergraduate degree and was contemplating doing a postgraduate LIS qualification what would you say to them? What sort of personal attributes do you think you need to go into LIS work? Particularly working with Children and Young Adults.
A lot of people I encounter have a fixed mind-set about librarians/libraries are, or should be. In a modern world that changes so quickly, people seem to cling to libraries as lifeboats that preserve a more ‘traditional’ way of life. People tend to think of libraries in comforting nostalgic terms, and this can be problematic when libraries are faced with the challenges of evolving, embracing technology, and providing service in a modern and convenient way.
Librarians themselves are not immune to this mind-set, and are often found to be resisting or avoiding change. It’s tricky for a library to be everything to everybody, and to balance out the traditional service aspects, which still have their place, with the more modern ones.
It’s important for librarians to have a flexible mind-set, to be enthusiastic about adapting and learning new skills continuously, to appreciate technology and understand its application and use in the information age. We are lucky to work in a field where we can self-define our identity and purpose, and change our services to meet the continuously evolving needs of our communities – which requires librarians to agile thinkers and entrepreneurs.
Working in CYA services, in particular, requires energy, considerable initiative in designing new and original children's programmes; ability to work well with young people, both individually and in groups; ability to deal effectively with parents, teachers and community organisations; confidence in presenting and being in front of groups; and the skills to advocate strongly for libraries and CYA interests to third parties. Like most customer and public-facing roles, a sense of humour is a must.
I really enjoyed doing my qualification. It has given me an appreciation of the skills and knowledge required across the whole spectrum of library roles, and I often refer back to my studies to guide my decisions in regards to best practice and industry consistency. The papers are very useful in helping me to design modern services and strategy that meets the developmental and social needs of young people. Regardless of whether you pursue a career in libraries, I feel that the qualifications are important and useful in this modern information age, and are widely transferable into other fields of work.
If someone was thinking about changing careers to become a CYA librarian what sorts of jobs do you think would bring good transferable skills? I guess teaching is an obvious one, can you think of any others? Acting? Events management?
Yes, teaching is an obvious one; teachers bring so many transferable skills. Often we have employed people from the arts, performance, or creative industries – they have an innovative flair and a different viewpoint of the world. For public libraries especially, a customer service background is always desirable; the ability to positively interact with the wide array of library users is essential. People with social work backgrounds are bringing a skill set that is increasingly in demand in public libraries; for CYA librarians experience as a Youth Worker or working in the child/youth social support sector would appeal to us. We also sometimes see people make the sideways move across from museums and galleries; those who have worked in public programming in the GLAM sector will be very useful in CYA librarianship, as well as for other customer group specialities.
Have you got any librarian mentors / people who influenced you or you admire / learned from? What did they teach you?
The first person I really noticed as being influential on me was Su Scott, who was the manager at Waitakere Libraries. She showed me that libraries could be a progressive and innovative place, and always surprised me with ideas that were considered radical at the time, but clearly she was just ahead of her time. She gave me opportunities that allowed me to stretch into new comfort zones and explore my potential. She showed me that a library career could be an exciting and rewarding option. Much of the reason I am working in libraries I credit to her.
The people that have influenced me the most are those who allow others to take on responsibility and participate, and help them to navigate the workload as coaches. Early on I learned that literacy is not about books, but about people, language and connections, and to focus on the mortar as much as the bricks. Others have taught me to look at obstacles as things to overcome and not as excuses, and how to adjust my leadership and communication styles to those I am leading, rather than to suit myself and my preferences. More recently a library manager that I look up to told me to value myself and my time more by saying ‘no’ every so often, and I might be surprised that I become more productive, not less.
You have a very exciting sounding life outside of libraries. Can you tell us about all your extracurricular activities? How do you balance work and play? Have you learned anything from your recreational pursuits that inform your library work?
I work full-time for Wellington City Libraries, and part-time as a Combat Medic in the New Zealand Army Reserve. I also do triathlons (long-distance and Ironman), and the odd ultramarathon. I have a lovely preschooler who is my number one fan when it comes to reading stories aloud. Shout out to my super supportive husband!
I enjoy a busy and full life, but it’s tricky to balance it all out. I have a few tricks up my sleeve. I don’t have a customer-facing component or a roster in my job, so I’m able to be quite fluid in when and where I work. I often snatch work time in the mornings, evenings, and weekends to create a more flexible day or week for myself, and if I’m between meetings I’ll often ‘hotdesk’ with my laptop in a cafe with WiFi rather than return to the office. I use time when I’m running, biking, or swimming to have a meeting with myself to make lists, priorities, decisions, and plans, which means I’m ready to get cracking when I log in. I’ve figured out that I work best with a deadline, so I plot out all my work and projects against dates, and hold myself accountable to them.
I’m used to being very independent, so I’m still learning how to delegate and ask for help when I need it. It’s a current focus for me to get better at this. I’ve realised in attempting to do all the work myself that I’m not allowing others to grow and learn.
The New Zealand Army has a unique way of training and growing people that has had a positive impact on my overall approach to work and life. Not least it has given me new benchmarks in hard work, and what I can personally endure and achieve. My army training has given me the courage to make decisions, develop personal discipline that takes over when motivation has a bit of a break, and to act fast on the information available to me. A sense of personal integrity means I’m not afraid to admit when I’ve stuffed up.
In trying to fit sport training around all other aspects of my job, my number one rule is ‘gears before beers’. I finish a training session, tidy up, repack for the next round, do the laundry (the gears) before relaxing to reflect, recharge, and learn the lessons (the beers). Too often we lurch from one project or priority to the next without closing off the former and taking the time to reflect and learn.
Most importantly I try to always keep my sense of humour and see the funny side of a situation. Personal resilience is so important, especially when things are not going to plan, so I’m always ready to have a laugh at myself and the situation.
You sound extremely efficient with your time management! I love the idea of how you “use time when I’m running, biking, or swimming to have a meeting with myself to make lists, priorities, decisions, and plans” Do you have any other life hacks you can share with our readers?
Most of my hacks are in the way I think and approach things rather than physical (except you should always carry a notebook or some way to record your ideas and inspiration). Our actions and behaviours are usually a representation of how we think and process internally, so you can make adjustments to your outputs by changing what’s happening internally. Here’s some that come to mind:
- Surround yourself with the people you need, not necessarily the people you want.
- Don’t be a slave to unnecessary rules. Too often we experience rules, procedures, rosters etc. preventing us from doing what we need to do, when these things should actually help us to achieve our priorities and workloads. Check which rules/procedures you actually own, and have the power to change, to pivot them in support of your work.
- Start your day by doing the thing that you are least looking forward so it doesn’t hold power over you for the rest of the day.
- Everyday I try to be stronger than my excuses, after all you always get what you settle for.
- I’ve noticed that my strength doesn’t come from what I can do, but from overcoming things I once thought I couldn’t. If I want to get stronger I look at the things I am actively avoiding and aim to overcome them and eliminate them as a point of anxiety.
- My inbox is not my work. Schedule time in your day to switch your email on, clear new messages and close it down again.
- If something seems overwhelming, break it into smaller tasks and then complete an ‘easy win’ as your first task. Breaking the ice with an early success can be a great motivator.
- I’ve figured out the time of day when I’m most alert and productive, and set up boundaries around it so I can use it to tackle my most important work.
These are gold! Thanks so much Adrienne for sharing your knowledge and experiences with us.